Whats with the ZM people?

[cheese]

On almost every server there is at least one or two people who have played ZM and compare it to Zombie Panic: Source. They complain about how bad this mod is and that ZM is so much better yet they can't stop playing this mod.

I haven't played ZM but I've heard some about it. Like how people just keep sending one type called a banshee thats really hard to kill. I don't get why people would constantly say that it's better than ZP:S though.

Anyone actually play ZM enough to see if its even comparable to ZP:S?

It reminds me of Brainbread vs Zombie Panic

[RED_CAP]

hmm true
well I have played with some one who just downloaded the game and all he ever says is if he dies
"camping noob"
even said
"noob gravity"
after he fell
and keeps calling people that kill him noobs
well I have had zm for like a year but I think ZPS kicks zm in its bad graphic ???

[Arctic]

Zombie master gets old fast, zombies get stuck and the gameplay gets dull after a while, it isnt scary at all, and banshees are paper zombies, 1 rifle hit gets them down. Zombie Panic! is a lot better, A LOT.

[Ussr1943]

Personally I'd have to say while they are both zombie games, they both have two very different styles. Both are fun to play (barring Im talking about ZP1 ,I'm waiting for patch to play ZPS). ZM is interesting in that one person plays almost like an RTS and controls the zombies while everyone elese plays an FPS trying to complete objectives. ZP though has human zombies making it much more challanging and fun aswell.

[RED_CAP]

yes but ZM has lack of weapons
a 20/80 shot pistol
a 30/60 shot mac 10 (which wasts ammo quickly)
a 8/24 shot shotgun
sledge hammer
crowbar
fists

[Kommando]

yes but ZM has lack of weapons
a 20/80 shot pistol
a 30/60 shot mac 10 (which wasts ammo quickly)
a 8/24 shot shotgun
sledge hammer
crowbar
fists

Yeah. You forgot to mention the Winchester rifle, though. But nonetheless, they have way too few weapons, and not to mention their dev team has an ????ty attitude in that area; they have outright said they will not be adding anymore weapons (serious weapons that is, not any RPGs or Gauss guns), because they think it will unbalance the game, which is an idiotic arguement at best, since it is up to the mapmakers whether a wider variety of weapons will unbalance the game or not.

But regardless, I would like to say that Zombie Master is a great game aswell. It is great fun using traps to kill survivors as the ZM, and to shot down hordes of player-controlled zombies as one of the survivors. ZP:S still kicks its ???, though!

[CodeFire]

Yes, I too have met many biased players/forum users. It really saddens me when I see them try and put the mod down. A lot of them go overboard with the issues and make it bigger then it really is.

[acker]

I like both ZP:S and ZM. Both based on zombies, but completely different gameplay.

ZP=run, grab weapons, camp. Replenish ammo when necessary. The weapons/ammo are everything in this game.

ZM=grab weapons, break through ZM defenses, finish objectives. You can beat the ZM without firing a shot, but it's generally difficult. The objective comes before anything else in this game. Even killing zombies is only a way to get to the objective (the ZM team is removing the kill counter next version). In fact, randomly killing zombies is discouraged in this game because the ZM can simply spawn more zombies, and ammunition is limited.

The ZM team is also adding revolvers and Molotovs. The ZP team is adding a lot of stuff to their game.

Don't bother comparing the two.

[s0m3 guy]

I've played both, currently ZM is progressing and is in 1.1.3, heading for 1.2.0. ZP:S is in beta 1, which well is quite bad, I stopped playing beta 1 and now I'm just waiting for beta 2, HOPING it's more fun rather annoying.

[Mitsu]

After quite a few plays, I can sum up BOTH games from my experiences in each. All opinionated and biased of course.

ZM : Play a few times. Possibly win. Majority of the time lose as the Zombie Master SPAMS infinite amount of zombies in a chokepoint and the game becomes an ??? factory of sitting around for 30 minutes waiting for the map to change. Also, everyone and their mom's microphone spam the ???? out of everything.

Most games come down to rushing as fast as possible or sitting out ZM spam till the next map runs. You die... ????. 30 minute wait to play again unless you were that one guy camping one spot all the time.

ZPS: You're GOING TO FRIGGIN DIE. That's it. That's ZPS for you. It looks awesome, and plays -remarkably- well on the release maps. Let's look at the scenarios.
1) You don't get any weapons and maybe a handgun - DIE
2) You get a weapon - DIE
3) You get a weapon and have a good team - DIE (depending on server size)
4) You die - You're friggin dead.

The difference is.. you have FUN dying. FUN. Remember that? ZPS rounds are usually very short, so dying can be more fun than surviving sometimes.


Anytime someone compares ZPS to ZM in a game like they were King ??? himself, I just pray NO ONE says anything and the complaining person leaves out of boredom.

Remember, don't feed the trolls.

[Ussr1943]

Honestly:
The only thing they have in common is that they involve zombies, after that they are two completely diff. entities that cannot be compared.

[samhain]

their just in defensive fanboy mode, they will realize it soon enough

[[AUS] Midnight]

Zombie Master and Zombie Panic are different games with the same theme....

The zombie apocalypse has arrived...its time to lock and load

Both games are fun and it would be unfair to compare them to each other.....I love both of them!!

[Hastings]

Mitsu, just because YOU cant win and YOU always die doesnt mean that everyone else does. The game needs to be tweaked to allow for more survivor wins, but it is still possible to win now. :sleep:

[ZombiesPanic]

Because it's the only other Zombie Mod for source, what are they going to compare it to, Dystopia? Insurgency?

[SotaPoika]

When there's game about zombie killing it means only one thing: Zombies can win, human can only survive (everyone knows why)! There should be timer which tells you how much time you have to survive or that you have a escape mission. Those are my toughts.

[jancuks]

I played zombie master and its normal but in that case i preffer Sven coop, but i hate that bullets don't make any damage to zombie and its impossible to kill a half of them :/

I tried ZPS, ZP, Zombie Survival on gmod and CSS Zombie mod, only ZPS is the best of all and Zombie survival normal other zombie mods are just booring :/ only ZPS makes any sense :)

[redeye_jedi]

i was zm server yesterday and asked if any 1 had played zp and as soon as i said that about 4 ppl just started taking the piss out of the game saying how ???? it was, i was like haha its much better than this poorly made mod (lets be honest now, zm was poorly made) and there was a big argument on the server about zp v zm.

and to the TC zm as badly made as it is, at times it is quite a good game, its not better than zps though.

and yes your right the zm only spawns certain typesof zombies, usually the zm will make a wall of hulks and guard the objectives thus making it near impossible to win

[Scribbles]

I remember playing Zombie Master and I didn't really like it. The maps were pretty horrible and the game didn't have atmosphere. Also some things were downright weird, sparks appearing out of nowhere, exploding barrels and all that. Also it was highly repetitive because all the objective items spawned in the same spot.

It seemed kinda like a 'left4dead' ripoff, but where a player could play as the zombie master. At least it wasn't horribly bad, like brainbread was compared to the old zombie panic. The mods are different enough to each attract a different audience, so there shouldn't really be any problems. maybe if more people play Zombie Master, there will finally be some free spots on the ZP:S servers. :(

[Captain Teamkill]

ZM guys just seem to not like any other mod. As though they were rivals or something :(

[CaptainSnake]

I remember seeing someone from Empires Mod lol

[V0rr1k]

ZM is like the local bike, everyones had a ride but it gets old fast...
ZP at least has longevity... like a CAT :D

[Mitsu]

Mitsu, just because YOU cant win and YOU always die doesnt mean that everyone else does. The game needs to be tweaked to allow for more survivor wins, but it is still possible to win now. :sleep:

Oh, I never meant to say it wasn't possible. It is quite possible, I'm just trying to contrast the difference between winning in ZM and ZPS. I'll label my post with /sarcasm in a bit maybe, seeing as I suppose it was taken the wrong way. Ah well.

Oh, and I -choose- not to live, for I am the GARDENER. Wielding the almighty melee shovel to bump zombies off of ledges with prejudice. And anger.

You're just jealous that I 1v1 zombies in epic duels of valor and suicide.

/joke

[Captain Teamkill]

I remember seeing someone from Empires Mod lol

I'm from empires :) Just under a different name :P

[Draco122]

It's not fair really to compare ZPS to ZM as of now, as ZM is much further in development. Not to mention they are both two different types of mod.

ZPS is more about Surviving the Zombies for as long as possible and is primarly FPS based while ZM is about completing Objectives and is based on a combination of RTS Tactics versus FPS gameplay.

At the moment I can see ZM winning but only because it's current version 1.1.3 has most of the bugs and glitches finished while ZPS is only a Beta 1 and has plenty of bugs and glitches still there. It's a little too early to compare these two games to each other.

ZM uses the Human vs NPC set up while ZPS uses the more common Human vs Human style, with one team playing as Survivors with another playing as Zombies.

The weapon system as well is different compared to ZPS and ZM.

With ZPS, you typically have alot of weapons allowing people to come across them at regular intervals, but ammunition is a different story.

In ZM, weapons are rare and is meant to encourage team play, whereas Ammo for weapons are usually common.

Also ZPS has med Kits, while ZM does not.

I could go on with everything that sets these two mod apart but I won't because there just too much to explain about these two modes.

Besides ZPS will get better in the long run, every mod starts off bad but gets better later on

EDIT:

And even if people think that ZM is a ????ty mod, I think the Dev team deserve some credit as they don't have a very big dev team (there's only like 4-5 people on the entire ZM Dev team with one guy doing all the coding!)

[Angry Lawyer]

Thought I might as well make an appearance here.

Comparing ZM to ZP is like comparing satsumas to cheese. Yeah, both are sorta-orange in colour and are edible, but the comparison stops there. ZM is a strategy game with shooty bits. ZP is an infection game-type. They're both coloured orange/contain zombies, but similarities end there.

My best wishes to the team, anyways - you've gone a step further than most people, and have entered the hallowed ranks of released HL2 mods that aren't arse. Be prepared for months of people ?????ing because you're not making the game exactly the way they want it, and countless heisenbugs that'll haunt you just before every release. Just remember - don't lose track of what you're trying to achieve, no matter how much people drown you out with their cries.

Happy new year, from one of the coders of ZM, and here's to a successful future in third party mods.

Edits: Also, Zombie Master was imagined while on the "thinking throne" after a long session of the original ZP.

-Angry Lawyer

[RED_CAP]

Yeah. You forgot to mention the Winchester rifle, though. But nonetheless, they have way too few weapons, and not to mention their dev team has an ????ty attitude in that area; they have outright said they will not be adding anymore weapons (serious weapons that is, not any RPGs or Gauss guns), because they think it will unbalance the game, which is an idiotic arguement at best, since it is up to the mapmakers whether a wider variety of weapons will unbalance the game or not.

But regardless, I would like to say that Zombie Master is a great game aswell. It is great fun using traps to kill survivors as the ZM, and to shot down hordes of player-controlled zombies as one of the survivors. ZP:S still kicks its ???, though!

and that Waffles guy pisses people off:mad:

[Angry Lawyer]

Don't be hating Waffles. He's just passionate about his games, as I'd imagine you guys are.

-Angry Lawyer

[sanitarium]

Some people get too defensive about a particular game in my opinion. To say that one or the other is definitively better is an exercise in futility, as the idea of being "better" is entirely subjective and in no way factual.

Both games have their strengths and weaknesses. Zombie Panic's glaring weakness to me is how lopsided the game is. I've played maybe 100 rounds of ZP so far, and I've seen the survivors win exactly one time. Knowing the outcome of the round 99.9% of the time seriously detracts from the overall experience. It's like watching a sporting event and already knowing what the final score will be. Sure it might be fun for a while, but how long are you going to play the game when it's the same every time?

With Zombie Master, one of the worst problems is something that the devs can't really control... the general character of the people that play the game. I've never in my time of playing Half-Life related games seen such a high percentage of griefers, mic spammers, and general idiots. And yes, I've played plenty of Counter-Strike if you're wondering. That's the biggest turn off for Zombie Master, the fact that it's so easy to ruin the experience for everyone else.

As far as positives, Zombie Panic has more than once gotten my heart racing. When you're being chased by zombies that can think, it makes it that much scarier when you're the last guy running for your life. In Zombie Master, I never get any sort of thrill because the zombies are so easily outsmarted. The only time it really gets exciting is if I'm the last guy alive and I know the ZM is concentrating on killing me.

In my opinion, Zombie Master is the better game at this point in time, gameplay wise. Which side is going to win is not set in stone, survivors actually have a chance if they work together. I know some of you are going to say "Yeah well, I win all the time as survivor". It seems based on all of the people that I've talked to about the game that you are the exception, not the rule. Don't get me wrong, Zombie Panic is fun. I'm going to keep playing it, no doubt about it, but to have any sort of longevity, the game needs to be about 75% in favor of zombies and 25% for survivor, instead of the 99.9% to .1% it has now.

[Hastings]

Which if you had read anything on the webisite or played the previous ZP, you would understand that that is what we intend to model the game after. Zombies win mosto f the time but humans can still win. Due to multiple things that need to be tweaked (which I and others have stated all over the boards in multiple places) it is insanely hard to win as humans, its not impossible, but at present it may as well be.

[Xanaris]

Angry Lawyer said that he was seeing if he could get the new patch out for January, and hopefully it will come out.

-ZPS's gameplay: Hide, run, shoot excessively into a zombie's face without much result. Survivors are too slow unless they've just got a vanilla pistol, which may be one of the more useful guns in the game. Good point about it is that you get a thrill when your being chased by a deformed yellow giant zombie down a hall with one clip left and a keyboard to whack it with.

-ZM's gameplay: Try to out-think the ZM or run fast to get the objective. Some bad players get on; but then again, doesn't every other mod? Frequently I get LMAO moments when a survivor got trapped in a trap that makes the ZM push a cuddly-looking bear statue on a unsuspecting Survivor.

All in all, I think both are good, but both could use improvments as well.

[k12]

I agree with Xanaris both are wonderful games but they both need tweaking.

The two games are completely different and you can just compare them.

[Barry Burton]

I like them both the same. Maybe ZPS more.

You cant really compare them. ZM has been out far longer than ZPS. And ZPS is only in version 1.0.0. And They are completely the same.

I really don't know what ZM people in particular have a problem with.

I think it's because they are arrogant and refuse to work with the team and go off rambo style like in ZM and kill everything with 2 hits. So they get killed. Which being the arrogant person they are they get frustrated so they go complain on ZM.

[sanitarium]

One of the main things I prefer at the moment is ZM's objective based gameplay. In Zombie Panic, it's just deathmatch. You grab a gun and run around till you die, or just camp and die. Whereas in Zombie Master, you actually have things to do to complete the map. There is a caveat to this however, and I mentioned it previously: ZM is a griefer's paradise. All it takes is one person to swipe an object like a battery or gas can required to complete the map and either hiding it or just throwing it to an unreachable area and the entire round is ruined.

Zombie Master has Panic beat in the variety category, simply because each map requires you to do something different to win, while in Panic there is no winning as the survivor team.

[Hastings]

There is winning as survivors team at present though rare, and we will be tweaking the game to ensure that survivors win as we intend them to, and ZM does not have ZPS beat in variety we have new everything from models to animations to textures to music to sounds, and we should have a objective based maps in our first major content expansion. Just about everything that was in ZP1 will debut in some form or fashion on zombie panic source and more.

That said I like ZM, but I do feel that we have created a superior game in ZPS due to everything we have added, in no way can we compare gamplay due to ZMs AI useage though. I find both fun in their own ways.

[acker]

And you are a Developer. That's most important.

[sanitarium]

There is winning as survivors team at present though rare, and we will be tweaking the game to ensure that survivors win as we intend them to, and ZM does not have ZPS beat in variety we have new everything from models to animations to textures to music to sounds, and we should have a objective based maps in our first major content expansion. Just about everything that was in ZP1 will debut in some form or fashion on zombie panic source and more.

That said I like ZM, but I do feel that we have created a superior game in ZPS due to everything we have added, in no way can we compare gamplay due to ZMs AI useage though. I find both fun in their own ways.

When I said variety, I meant gameplay. Each ZM map is different in what you have to do to win, sometimes it's holding an area for a few minutes, while other maps you have to reach a particular location.

ZP may have more weapons, but they're all equally useless in the end. Take the melee weapons. You have the golf club, ax, machete, keyboard, crowbar, etc, but how often can you rely on any of them to do anything useful? In Zombie Master, you may only have 2 melee weapons, but they are actually good for something. One whack to the head with the sledge hammer will drop a shambler, 5 or 6 whacks to the head in ZP might yield a kill, but you would have been better off dropping your weapon and just running.

I'll continue to follow ZP, mostly because I played the first one a lot and remember how fun it could be. The first release shows a lot of promise, the game absolutely looks great from the models to the maps and it has great atmosphere. I don't mean to sound like I'm against the mod, because I'm not. The only issue I had was game balance (somewhere about 75%-85% in favor of zombies), once that's worked out this mod should really take off.

[Hastings]

And you are a Developer. That's most important.

As in I am biased? Yeah probably everyone is about something, but everything I have pointed out about ZPS is true and I have not sugar coated anything. Everything after that is up to the players to decide.

It boils down to what you expect gameplay to be, and if you prefer AI based zombies ZM and l4d are for you, if you like our unique style of zombie gameplay then ZPS is for you, or like them both, I do. :P

[Captain Teamkill]

I thought the zombies, or at least some of the zombies in l4d were going to be human controlled?

[Hastings]

Not as far as I am aware of. Strictyl AI based with a bunch of paramilitary weapons similiar to CS using mostly CS textures for maps. It will be fun for sure I bet, but it will feel more like a mod than our game will, and thats just sad. I hope they put more effort into it if they play to sell it as such.

[sanitarium]

Not as far as I am aware of. Strictyl AI based with a bunch of paramilitary weapons similiar to CS using mostly CS textures for maps. It will be fun for sure I bet, but it will feel more like a mod than our game will, and thats just sad. I hope they put more effort into it if they play to sell it as such.

Actually, L4D will have player controlled zombies:

www.left4dead411.com/left-4-dead-preview-pg10

[Hastings]

Well thats nice of valve to ???? us and ZM over.

[sanitarium]

Look at it this way, most retail games don't have that certain charm you find with community developed mods like ZP. It's like going to Burger King instead of having a homecooked meal, the latter is made with a tender love and care that makes it all the sweeter... or something like that.

[Angry Lawyer]

Well thats nice of valve to ???? us and ZM over.

Hardly - it's only screwing you guys over if they suddenly add a gametype that allows for more than eight players and has people slowly switching to the zombie team after every death, and it's only screwing us over if they add a real-time-strategy camera.

-Angry Lawyer

[PErF3Ct]

but it will feel more like a mod than our game will, and thats just sad. I hope they put more effort into it if they play to sell it as such.
Wow, you're really cocky. I suppose it's good to be confident in your work though.

[Hastings]

Cocky? No, I just feel tat valve and turtle rock are not putting everyting into the game, and are also pandering to CS players. I it looks like CS, Shoots Like CS, and acts like CS, I wont play it much. Hopefully Valve proves me wrong.

[esJ]

To be fair though, they have little reason NOT to pander to what is, by far, the largest portion of their consumer base.

[RagTag]

Sorry Hasting, I love ya, but I gotta disagree with you here. L4D is nothing like CS except for the fact that you shoot at people. The game has a fun, enjoyable, and heart pounding experience for the survivors and a new type of experience never been done before while playing as the Boss Infected side.

L4D won't feel anything like a mod especially if you've read about it and watched footage. Here Hastings, read this from end to end and you'll more then likely change your mind and also be just as anxious to get your hands on this as I am.

http://left4dead411.com/left-4-dead-preview-pg1

[Teh Infernal Zombine]

On almost every server there is at least one or two people who have played ZM and compare it to Zombie Panic: Source. They complain about how bad this mod is and that ZM is so much better yet they can't stop playing this mod.

I haven't played ZM but I've heard some about it. Like how people just keep sending one type called a banshee thats really hard to kill. I don't get why people would constantly say that it's better than ZP:S though.

Anyone actually play ZM enough to see if its even comparable to ZP:S?

It reminds me of Brainbread vs Zombie Panic

Well ZM IS comparable to ZP:S... Like a trash can is compared to a dumpster! (Not in a way that ZP:S is a bigger load of trash in the other.... Just that- Ah never mind!)

ZP:S is a whole different genre than ZM, with ZM being a mix between RTS and FPS while ZP:S is more of a blend between adventure and FPS (You look around the corner, nothing to see.. You take a step forward! *dies* Oops! Looks like you should have brought friends with you after all! Thanks for playing Sier- Oh wait.. Wrong creators!)

[Scribbles]

To be fair though, they have little reason NOT to pander to what is, by far, the largest portion of their consumer base.

That's what we said before combat turned Natural Selection to ????.

[Kommando]

and that Waffles guy pisses people off:mad:

I can't say I like him either, but then again, I'm very easily annoyed and tend to dislike lots of people over even trivial matters. It depends on my mood too, though.

[redeye_jedi]

^^ me too, at college when all the first years joined i just had to look at some of them and i would be like " i ????ing hate that lad"

[PErF3Ct]

I made this movie while playing Zombie Master. For those who haven't played this mod, watch this little movie. It portrays several elements of ZM such as having slow dumb zombies, having objectives, holding your ground, and of course mic spamming (though the mic spam actually added a nice touch to this video).
[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hi7z7UAMQho&feature=related

One key difference in the games is that, in ZM, a lone zombie is no threat at all. It's all about the horde.